I'm unable to find a rule. i have asked any and every official i can get to speak to me. all of which get tight lipped and walk away saying it can't be done
With a B grade licence i'm asking to Run in:
Sportsman light.
Sportsman restricted light.
Often i come up against:
"You just cant." (orly?)
"Why would you want to? you cant" (because i enjoy racing)
Chapter 37.01 (second line) A & B grade licence holders are not eligible to compete in this class
As there each "yellow" chapter in the rule book is a seperate class this is invalid as the Sub reg's quote: "Sportsman 125" which I am asking to run in "Sportsman" with a restricted motor it falls under Rule 36.01. To be eligible to compete in a sportsman class up to 100cc or restricted up to 125cc a competitor a minimum of a D grade licence unless otherwise stated (in supp regulations i assume).Another i have come up against is a false AKA addendum or so i believe. if i face this again i will pursue this further.
Comments12
Which state are you in Callum?
I ask this because Victoria recently changed the ruling on "Sportsman restricted" (or so I believe, it was certainly an agenda item).
The rule was changed so that B grade drivers can't compete in restricted if the open class forms.
We were opposed to the change, insisting that clubs seeking to prevent B graders from competing in the restricted class should offer TaG restricted at their meetings - where B graders are ineligible regardless of open class formation.
The other potential issue is that if you are using the same kart, you can not remove exaust seal during the meeting to put the restrictor in and out.
In Victoria sportsman classes, it is ruled that you must run either open or resticted and can not run both at the one meeting.
I am in Victoria. and been an agenda item doesn't change the current rules.
I run separate chassis and motors.
I agree with Anthony Burke: however it is Tag that has such runs and should remain the entry level for 125 motors, and sportsman restricted as a way of introducing B and C grade racers where the C graders have had more experience. and Sportsman/Tag125 open as the endgame.
DO NOT GET TAG AND SPORTSMAN CONFUSED. same motors, different rules.
Anthony Burke said:
Which state are you in Callum?
I ask this because Victoria recently changed the ruling on "Sportsman restricted" (or so I believe, it was certainly an agenda item).
The rule was changed so that B grade drivers can't compete in restricted if the open class forms.
We were opposed to the change, insisting that clubs seeking to prevent B graders from competing in the restricted class should offer TaG restricted at their meetings - where B graders are ineligible regardless of open class formation.
If the rules has been changed can you please refer to the rule. I'm happy to be wrong. i just don't like being told I'm breaking the rules, when i'm well within my bounds
Callum, the the rules for "sportsman" classes are flexible to suit the needs of clubs/states.
I asked which state you were in because I have some knowledge of what Victoria are up to.
Basically, we (Mildura) wanted a scenario where people like me (B grade) would be eligible to compete in the restricted class at our clubdays - because the open class wasn't forming at that time.
We were able to make this work under the "sportsman" rule - rather than TaG/R eg. "sportsman restricted 125" was the new class that eventuated.
Since then, other clubs have offered this class and it has become popular. As I see it, a club that doesn't want B graders in restricted karts should simply offer TaG/R instead of sportsman restricted 125 - simple eh????
I'm pretty sure that the VKA created an addendum recently, preventing B grade drivers from entering the "sportsman restricted 125" class UNLESS the "sportsman 125" class doesn't form.
As far as I'm concerned, this is a backward step BUT it is the prerogative of each state to change the rules to suit the situation.
Basically, go to the VKA website and you should be able to find the relevant details. The AKA rulebook isn't the right source for the info you require.
Sorry for the long winded reply but I felt it was necessary for clarity.
Callum Clissold said:
Anthony Burke said:
Which state are you in Callum?
I ask this because Victoria recently changed the ruling on "Sportsman restricted" (or so I believe, it was certainly an agenda item).
The rule was changed so that B grade drivers can't compete in restricted if the open class forms.
We were opposed to the change, insisting that clubs seeking to prevent B graders from competing in the restricted class should offer TaG restricted at their meetings - where B graders are ineligible regardless of open class formation.
If the rules has been changed can you please refer to the rule. I'm happy to be wrong. i just don't like being told I'm breaking the rules, when i'm well within my bounds
Anthony u recon the AKA rule book isnt the right source ,why the hell do they bother printing it if every state just runs on rafeterys rules .I always said karts had it over speedway in the rules dept because you could go anywhere in aust and class and kart spec were the same. NOW ITS LIKE SCRAMBELLED EGGS no suprise that entries are a challenge.Anthony Burke said:
Callum, the the rules for "sportsman" classes are flexible to suit the needs of clubs/states.
I asked which state you were in because I have some knowledge of what Victoria are up to.
Basically, we (Mildura) wanted a scenario where people like me (B grade) would be eligible to compete in the restricted class at our clubdays - because the open class wasn't forming at that time.
We were able to make this work under the "sportsman" rule - rather than TaG/R eg. "sportsman restricted 125" was the new class that eventuated.
Since then, other clubs have offered this class and it has become popular. As I see it, a club that doesn't want B graders in restricted karts should simply offer TaG/R instead of sportsman restricted 125 - simple eh????
I'm pretty sure that the VKA created an addendum recently, preventing B grade drivers from entering the "sportsman restricted 125" class UNLESS the "sportsman 125" class doesn't form.
As far as I'm concerned, this is a backward step BUT it is the prerogative of each state to change the rules to suit the situation.
Basically, go to the VKA website and you should be able to find the relevant details. The AKA rulebook isn't the right source for the info you require.
Sorry for the long winded reply but I felt it was necessary for clarity.
Callum Clissold said:
Anthony Burke said:
Which state are you in Callum?
I ask this because Victoria recently changed the ruling on "Sportsman restricted" (or so I believe, it was certainly an agenda item).
The rule was changed so that B grade drivers can't compete in restricted if the open class forms.
We were opposed to the change, insisting that clubs seeking to prevent B graders from competing in the restricted class should offer TaG restricted at their meetings - where B graders are ineligible regardless of open class formation.
If the rules has been changed can you please refer to the rule. I'm happy to be wrong. i just don't like being told I'm breaking the rules, when i'm well within my bounds
Harvie, I'm with you. It's too damn complicated.
Having said that, the "sportsman" part of the book is specifically designed to be accomodating to the needs of the clubs and states - so it comes as no real shock that either of these parties would take the opportunity to molestificate as required Harvie Ramsden said:
Anthony u recon the AKA rule book isnt the right source ,why the hell do they bother printing it if every state just runs on rafeterys rules .I always said karts had it over speedway in the rules dept because you could go anywhere in aust and class and kart spec were the same. NOW ITS LIKE SCRAMBELLED EGGS no suprise that entries are a challenge.Anthony Burke said:
Callum, the the rules for "sportsman" classes are flexible to suit the needs of clubs/states.
I asked which state you were in because I have some knowledge of what Victoria are up to.
Basically, we (Mildura) wanted a scenario where people like me (B grade) would be eligible to compete in the restricted class at our clubdays - because the open class wasn't forming at that time.
We were able to make this work under the "sportsman" rule - rather than TaG/R eg. "sportsman restricted 125" was the new class that eventuated.
Since then, other clubs have offered this class and it has become popular. As I see it, a club that doesn't want B graders in restricted karts should simply offer TaG/R instead of sportsman restricted 125 - simple eh????
I'm pretty sure that the VKA created an addendum recently, preventing B grade drivers from entering the "sportsman restricted 125" class UNLESS the "sportsman 125" class doesn't form.
As far as I'm concerned, this is a backward step BUT it is the prerogative of each state to change the rules to suit the situation.
Basically, go to the VKA website and you should be able to find the relevant details. The AKA rulebook isn't the right source for the info you require.
Sorry for the long winded reply but I felt it was necessary for clarity.
Callum Clissold said:
Anthony Burke said:
Which state are you in Callum?
I ask this because Victoria recently changed the ruling on "Sportsman restricted" (or so I believe, it was certainly an agenda item).
The rule was changed so that B grade drivers can't compete in restricted if the open class forms.
We were opposed to the change, insisting that clubs seeking to prevent B graders from competing in the restricted class should offer TaG restricted at their meetings - where B graders are ineligible regardless of open class formation.
If the rules has been changed can you please refer to the rule. I'm happy to be wrong. i just don't like being told I'm breaking the rules, when i'm well within my bounds
I have an A grade licence and run in O40,s . How can i race 125's ?
I would still like to see the rule, I understand where you are coming from, but it is a "state" ruling for the Sportsman class. Any class rules can be modified for club day under rule 1.27 However I'm am coming up against this at opens. which are NOT covered by rule 1.27. I'm not asking opinions. I'm asking for the RULE the prohibits my entry into Sportsman restricted as well as Sportsman open. Anthony Burke said:
Harvie, I'm with you. It's too damn complicated.
Having said that, the "sportsman" part of the book is specifically designed to be accomodating to the needs of the clubs and states - so it comes as no real shock that either of these parties would take the opportunity to molestificate as required Harvie Ramsden said:
Anthony u recon the AKA rule book isnt the right source ,why the hell do they bother printing it if every state just runs on rafeterys rules .I always said karts had it over speedway in the rules dept because you could go anywhere in aust and class and kart spec were the same. NOW ITS LIKE SCRAMBELLED EGGS no suprise that entries are a challenge.Anthony Burke said:
Callum, the the rules for "sportsman" classes are flexible to suit the needs of clubs/states.
I asked which state you were in because I have some knowledge of what Victoria are up to.
Basically, we (Mildura) wanted a scenario where people like me (B grade) would be eligible to compete in the restricted class at our clubdays - because the open class wasn't forming at that time.
We were able to make this work under the "sportsman" rule - rather than TaG/R eg. "sportsman restricted 125" was the new class that eventuated.
Since then, other clubs have offered this class and it has become popular. As I see it, a club that doesn't want B graders in restricted karts should simply offer TaG/R instead of sportsman restricted 125 - simple eh????
I'm pretty sure that the VKA created an addendum recently, preventing B grade drivers from entering the "sportsman restricted 125" class UNLESS the "sportsman 125" class doesn't form.
As far as I'm concerned, this is a backward step BUT it is the prerogative of each state to change the rules to suit the situation.
Basically, go to the VKA website and you should be able to find the relevant details. The AKA rulebook isn't the right source for the info you require.
Sorry for the long winded reply but I felt it was necessary for clarity.
Callum Clissold said:
Anthony Burke said:
Which state are you in Callum?
I ask this because Victoria recently changed the ruling on "Sportsman restricted" (or so I believe, it was certainly an agenda item).
The rule was changed so that B grade drivers can't compete in restricted if the open class forms.
We were opposed to the change, insisting that clubs seeking to prevent B graders from competing in the restricted class should offer TaG restricted at their meetings - where B graders are ineligible regardless of open class formation.
If the rules has been changed can you please refer to the rule. I'm happy to be wrong. i just don't like being told I'm breaking the rules, when i'm well within my bounds
The sportsman class is not a stupid Idea, It allows a class to be created to suit clubs and states. If you dont like it, dont race it.
From the VKA minutes, May 2011.
Discussion on B grade licence holders entering into the Sportsman 125 R and Sportsman 125 classes at a race meetings. VKA COUNCIL/Minutes- May 2011 6
Clarification in regards to these classes:
This is intended for club days only - If there is not a class for the Sportsman 125 Unrestricted (B grade ) then they can compete in the Sportsman 125 restricted (using a restrictor plate suited for their engine.) This was not intended for open meetings.
This was the intention and approval by the state to assist Mildura and other clubs that had not enough for each class. To be for Vic Club days only.
Where is the rule, I dont recall seeing one anywhere, but the stewards are following the direction given by the VKA, Rule or no rule.
Take it to you club and challenge it.
IT would have been easier if sportsman was confined to club days and all open meetings and series were tag .IT is interesting to note CSS between leopard and rotax classes had a meeting average of about 15/16 in 2012 i can only see 4/5 of those names entered fof the 1st round some of that could be because of the change of meeting format or lack of funds maybe a suvey of karters who havent turned up not those that are already entered might find the answers . The series is good one but like will need improving numbers to go ahead in future years. Whoops sorry got of track abit ps i think someone should Callum where the rule is in the book where cant race sport restricted it is part of a stewards duty i believe' .Anthony Burke said:
Harvie, I'm with you. It's too damn complicated.
Having said that, the "sportsman" part of the book is specifically designed to be accomodating to the needs of the clubs and states - so it comes as no real shock that either of these parties would take the opportunity to molestificate as required Harvie Ramsden said:
Anthony u recon the AKA rule book isnt the right source ,why the hell do they bother printing it if every state just runs on rafeterys rules .I always said karts had it over speedway in the rules dept because you could go anywhere in aust and class and kart spec were the same. NOW ITS LIKE SCRAMBELLED EGGS no suprise that entries are a challenge.Anthony Burke said:
Callum, the the rules for "sportsman" classes are flexible to suit the needs of clubs/states.
I asked which state you were in because I have some knowledge of what Victoria are up to.
Basically, we (Mildura) wanted a scenario where people like me (B grade) would be eligible to compete in the restricted class at our clubdays - because the open class wasn't forming at that time.
We were able to make this work under the "sportsman" rule - rather than TaG/R eg. "sportsman restricted 125" was the new class that eventuated.
Since then, other clubs have offered this class and it has become popular. As I see it, a club that doesn't want B graders in restricted karts should simply offer TaG/R instead of sportsman restricted 125 - simple eh????
I'm pretty sure that the VKA created an addendum recently, preventing B grade drivers from entering the "sportsman restricted 125" class UNLESS the "sportsman 125" class doesn't form.
As far as I'm concerned, this is a backward step BUT it is the prerogative of each state to change the rules to suit the situation.
Basically, go to the VKA website and you should be able to find the relevant details. The AKA rulebook isn't the right source for the info you require.
Sorry for the long winded reply but I felt it was necessary for clarity.
Callum Clissold said:
Anthony Burke said:
Which state are you in Callum?
I ask this because Victoria recently changed the ruling on "Sportsman restricted" (or so I believe, it was certainly an agenda item).
The rule was changed so that B grade drivers can't compete in restricted if the open class forms.
We were opposed to the change, insisting that clubs seeking to prevent B graders from competing in the restricted class should offer TaG restricted at their meetings - where B graders are ineligible regardless of open class formation.
If the rules has been changed can you please refer to the rule. I'm happy to be wrong. i just don't like being told I'm breaking the rules, when i'm well within my bounds
I have been away from this site for a long while and now come back to comments like "the rule is not in the rule book"
Why do we have to buy the book each year then?
I think I will just go back to my dirtbike and wide open spaces!!!
Too Freaking difficult