Has anyone had experience on the MG RED and gone and tested between 40mm and 50 mm axles? What did you find? I realise this is a very open question as it can vary on the day and kart and all that, but as a general finding what did you think of the 40 compared to the 50...
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Best person to ask would be James Sera, I know he did a fair bit of testing leading up to CoM with the 50mm.
Fongy, you should be using a 30mm in your Midget kart...
25mm solid, get it right.
Hey Fongy,
I have a 25mm setup if you want!!
Luke Fong said:25mm solid, get it right.
Jeez Fongy - You're Copping a Hiding Here!!! - Well, I guess that'll teach you to use a curtain rod filled with concrete as an axle!!!
On a more serious note, i've run both set-ups, but i'm far from an expert, but my "feeling" is that the 50mm settles the kart much more - I really notice it from turn in til the apex - but as I said, that's just me.
Cheers
Phil
Just another question about axles.
Well 2 questions. How do you tell the differnce betweeen hard soft medium axles? 50mm
and second question, I am 6"4 and 105 kg and have a 30/32 monaco with a 50mm axle. I realise i should probably have a 32/32 kart but i dont so get over it. :) My question is will i be able to run a medium axle, is it worth running one and what sort of difference will it make from medium to hard.
Ben,
You would normally run a hard axle to obtain more grip - that's a basic answer I know. Your height and your weight may negate that though, there maybe more learned people on here that could answer the question, ie Col, Willie, etc.
Cheers
Phil
Fongy, I will share what i have learnt on this topic. Keeping in mind we tested 40 vs 50 mm for 6weeks approx 900 laps give or take a few and testing could be conducted with in a genuine 1 / 10th throughout the session.
40 vs 50mm i found the 40mm axle of a very similar grade to the 50 to absorb the bumps nicer and it made the chassis feel lazy on entry and exit. However the data showed at the tight apexes it was marginally better. The biggest difference was the feel the 50 gave it felt like the kart shot off the turns and the times stayed more consistent, however there was approximately 1/ 10th difference between the 2.
The knowledge i have found on this next part i would like reaffirmed by our resident guru because as i have very recently learnt at COM has stumped me a little.
Here it goes, at home on a slippery track the hard gave grip (faster) and the soft got rid of grip (slower) for both the 50mm and 40mm. Now that i use 50 all the time i found at COM where there was some grip the hard actually felt like it took grip away (faster) and the super soft certainly gave grip (slower). the difference between the axles was the hard was very agile and the kart sat on top of the rubber and got quicker every lap, the soft made the kart feel lazy,smooth , the tire pressures got higher and engine hotter.
These were my findings if this sounds right Col could you please let me know? however if it doesnt when is the next big meet so i can go and test this again.
I at no stage admit that i am good in any way however we do put a big effort into making the chassis work as well as possible for a super heavy. It only gets you so far always whinging about not having enough HP as i realise it is useless with out the right setup! so the more you can learn about track condition and kart set up the better off you will be. Look at the SERA boys they have it down to a tea at the moment.
Hope this this helps some.
Dave, that's excellent feedback! A conscious effort at testing and noting results. Congrats to you. One of the best statements is "we do put a big effort into making the chassis work as well as possible for a super heavy. It only gets you so far always whinging about not having enough HP as i realise it is useless with out the right setup! so the more you can learn about track condition and kart set up the better off you will be.
How true is this!!!
Cheers
Phil
at home on a slippery track the hard gave grip (faster) and the soft got rid of grip (slower)
i found at COM where there was some grip the hard actually felt like it took grip away (faster) and the super soft certainly gave grip (slower).
if this sounds right Col could you please let me know?
Dave, outstanding work.
Nail.
Head.
Hit.
Changing axles won't have the same effect on the kart in all conditions. In fact, nothing on a kart will, but axles are a great example. The mathematics behind axles I have not fully thought through yet, and it annoys me greatly that people confuse the engineering uses of the words "stiffer" and "harder" which DO NOT mean the same thing, but I'll stay away from that can of worms long enough to relate what axles tend to work when, in my experience.
Club day track - you can tend to set up the kart with a "harder is more grip" strategy, and go for the most grip possible, without bogging the kart down. I try to set up with the hardest axle that will still drive off the corner nicely - which, depending on the track or kart, may only be a shortened medium axle (the todd road club day axle).
Grippy track - a hard axle will hold a wheel up longer. A soft axle tends to lift quickly, and drop quickly, resulting in a gripped-up corner exit. I try to set up with the softest axle that will still drive off the corner nicely - which, depending on the track or kart, may be a full length hard axle (like at the bolivar state titles 05 which was grippy as)!
Medium track? --- that is the skill, knowing what to use!
Hope I've confused the situation for everyone enough :)
Fongy will be back with further testing info soon, as he's ordered a bunch of 50mm stuff off me :)
I have one other LONG post to write one day about axle grades... we'll save that one for a later date.
just quickly dave, with your 6 weeks of axle testing, was that in the Kosmic? or the kart you had before (omega?)
and if you tested the 40 in the kosmic, where you using tonykart axles or jsut DPE ones?
Hi Josh,
The test comparison was done in the omega and with prodezine axles for both. Since changing to the kosmic which was not very long ago i have only done different axle grades using OTK axles which was kindly donated by TD racing for testing.( sorry had to get that in, Craig has helped me a heap since making the change and it is very appreciated).
I still found a similar result using OTK to the Prodezine though.
Col, Thanks for putting my mind at some ease as that has eaten me up since coming home as i know i cant test in those conditions again until the SA open.
Josh did you stick with the N or go harder? at COM cause your kart was on rails Saturday and a bullet in the rain. Not taking away your driving ability in the rain Josh but I have never been smashed by that much in the rain ever! thank god it is raining this weekend and i can sort the kart out as it was terrible. Peace of mind though so was all the others lol good job.
Josh Brooker said:just quickly dave, with your 6 weeks of axle testing, was that in the Kosmic? or the kart you had before (omega?) and if you tested the 40 in the kosmic, where you using tonykart axles or jsut DPE ones?